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Separation Anxiety!







cindy_pebbles
Member


Mar 29, 2007, 7:15 PM

Post #1 of 11 (4347 views)
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Separation Anxiety! Can't Post

Hi All, I know that I had posted something like this some time ago but I have yet to find a solution for this problem so I thought maybe someone out there has experience with this before and can teach me or give me some tips. Hehe.
I suspect my 6mths old MS puppy is having terrible separation anxiety. Whenever he is left alone downstairs and if he knew someone was upstairs and vice versa, he will bark and howl and whine and in a few more seconds, he will poo/pee wherever he is at that time. Sigh. Can anyone teach me how to deal with this? I tried the "leave him alone for awhile, then coming back to him and leave him longer and coming back to him" but it's not working! Besides, he not only does that to me, he does that to whoever is in the house. Say, if I were in a room with him and my mom, and if I go out from the room, he is ok coz my mom is in there. But if both of us went out, in like 5 seconds, he will start barking and etc. Sheez... just like yesterday, I carried him upstairs (coz he can't climb yet due to his op) and suddenly remembered I left my handphone downstairs. So, I told him to wait for me there (takkan carry him down again right?) and went down to take the hp. When I got up, he was pee-ing on the rug. Later at night, when we wanna sleep, I put him into his cage and gave him a pillow. And suddenly, I went to the next room to take something and when I came back (just about 20 secs), he already peed into his pillow!!!!
Any idea? Or did I something wrong?

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jessyca_loh
K9 Maniac


Mar 29, 2007, 7:29 PM

Post #2 of 11 (4344 views)
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Re: [cindy_pebbles] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Cindy,

My 3 mths old poodle is also having the same problems lor, the moment we leave her alone in the room, in her cage or just in my room n there's no one around, she will whine but now she has upgraded to barking liao..if there's someone in the room, she will be quiet n not make a sound..im trying the 'leave them alone' method and she seems very smart cos she knows whenever im at home i would come back to check on her n she wont make a sound one..but when i leave for work she will start to bark at me..she will quieten down when my dad is awake n in the room accompanying her lor..sigh..im also trying to find a solution for my puppy..im staying in a landed house now with my parents but when i moved out later to apartment, im hoping this problem would be fixed..if not sure kena complain by neighbours one..


cindy_pebbles
Member


Mar 30, 2007, 12:03 AM

Post #3 of 11 (4338 views)
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Re: [jessyca_loh] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Jess,

My MS is slightly different from your Poodle in the sense that he will only bark and whine if he knew that there are ppl in the house but he can't see them. Hehe. But when he saw us leaving the house, usually he won't be crying but will poo/pee. Hehe. So, every morning, i put him in his crate and pretend to go to work and he will poo and pee and i immediately clean his crate and then will only really go work. If not, he sure will step and lay on his poo. Yuck! Frown
Anyone can help us with this? I really don't know what to do with him..haha..have to bring him everywhere I go..but usually he will follow me everywhere I go...don't even have to bring him along... :p

We have a new member in our family! Her name is Jessie, a toy poodle!



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http://www.benjiboyboy.blogspot.com





jessyca_loh
K9 Maniac


Mar 30, 2007, 12:13 AM

Post #4 of 11 (4336 views)
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Re: [cindy_pebbles] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post

Nana used to whine when she cant see us also one..but i kinda get her to quieten down on that liao. She does follow me everywhere when im at home also..so now im trying to placed her crate outside in the living room lor, try to separate the time she spent with me and see..kinda train her to be independant a bit..

my bf tot she may have separation anxiety with me for they do tend to treat us as their mom so currently am trying 2 methods lor..leave them alone method n leave her crate outside lor..and after Nana's last jab will bring her out for walks n plan for gatherings for her to socialised with and see how from there..


Lady Eloise
Dog Kichi


Mar 30, 2007, 9:23 AM

Post #5 of 11 (4329 views)
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Re: [cindy_pebbles] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Hi All, I know that I had posted something like this some time ago but I have yet to find a solution for this problem so I thought maybe someone out there has experience with this before and can teach me or give me some tips. Hehe.
I suspect my 6mths old MS puppy is having terrible separation anxiety. Whenever he is left alone downstairs and if he knew someone was upstairs and vice versa, he will bark and howl and whine and in a few more seconds, he will poo/pee wherever he is at that time. Sigh. Can anyone teach me how to deal with this? I tried the "leave him alone for awhile, then coming back to him and leave him longer and coming back to him" but it's not working! Besides, he not only does that to me, he does that to whoever is in the house. Say, if I were in a room with him and my mom, and if I go out from the room, he is ok coz my mom is in there. But if both of us went out, in like 5 seconds, he will start barking and etc. Sheez... just like yesterday, I carried him upstairs (coz he can't climb yet due to his op) and suddenly remembered I left my handphone downstairs. So, I told him to wait for me there (takkan carry him down again right?) and went down to take the hp. When I got up, he was pee-ing on the rug. Later at night, when we wanna sleep, I put him into his cage and gave him a pillow. And suddenly, I went to the next room to take something and when I came back (just about 20 secs), he already peed into his pillow!!!!
Any idea? Or did I something wrong?



Cindy.

First of all you have two completely different issues here. Peeing and pooping in the house may be the result of lack of potty training and also may be the dog's way of letting the owners know he does not want to be left alone. Your dog requires a lot of attention, so start by making sure (when you not around) your puppy to play alone.

Do not give in the howling or whining. This would be the same of picking up a child every time he cries. Leave him alone ..walk back and forth and when he barks, tell the dog in the stern voice not yell, use commands that everything is fine that you are close by like 'Sheeeh' or 'Quiet'...then leave him again. Repeat this process and training him everyday. Give him chew toys or bones to play when you not around. Play with him a little before you leave and show him a toy so that will be familiar with it.

After the meal time, take the dog outside and wait for the dog to eliminate. Next take your dog outside/potty area regularly specifically for the purpose of doing his business frequently and praise/reward when your dog goes with a treat. The more frequent the outdoor/potty trips, the more likely you will catch him doing the right thing. Punishment like scolding/yelling for a small mistake in the house will likely worsen the situation here. So make sure all of your emphasis is on what he does right.

Do not allow the dog to watch you clean up the mess after the accident too. On the other hand, every time your dog finishes meals take him out for potty by create a 'timetable'. The more comfortable he is without you (with the toy training and potty schedule) the better his success will be.

Good luck.



Frown
Dog behaviorist.

(This post was edited by Lady Eloise on Mar 30, 2007, 9:29 AM)


cindy_pebbles
Member


Mar 30, 2007, 5:45 PM

Post #6 of 11 (4314 views)
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Re: [Lady Eloise] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post

Cindy.

First of all you have two completely different issues here. Peeing and pooping in the house may be the result of lack of potty training and also may be the dog's way of letting the owners know he does not want to be left alone. My dog was already toilet-trained when he was 3 months old but he will only do it when I am with him. If I leave him alone for awhile, he will (which I assumed) purposely peed/pooed on the floor. BTW, I trained my dog to do it in the toilet as I want him to run freely in the house when he is older. I did not teach him to eliminate outside. Your dog requires a lot of attention, so start by making sure (when you not around) your puppy to play alone.

Do not give in the howling or whining. This would be the same of picking up a child every time he cries. Leave him alone ..walk back and forth and when he barks, tell the dog in the stern voice not yell, use commands that everything is fine that you are close by like 'Sheeeh' or 'Quiet'...then leave him again. Everytime I move about to somewhere where he can't see me, he will whine and bark, quiet down (that's when he peed/pooed) and then, started barking and whining again. He is very very persistent! He once whined for 1.5 hours non-stop (awhile when he pooed)! Repeat this process and training him everyday. Give him chew toys or bones to play when you not around. Play with him a little before you leave and show him a toy so that will be familiar with it. Yeah, I did that. He will always play with his toy if and only if I were there. If I walk away, he will immediately stop playing and see where I go. Of coz, when I am away, I am not sure what he did tho'. Hehe. Even when he is eating, when I leave him alone by going upstairs, he will stop eating immediately and go up the stairs to look for me. Is this normal?

After the meal time, take the dog outside and wait for the dog to eliminate. Next take your dog outside/potty area regularly specifically for the purpose of doing his business frequently and praise/reward when your dog goes with a treat. The more frequent the outdoor/potty trips, the more likely you will catch him doing the right thing. Punishment like scolding/yelling for a small mistake in the house will likely worsen the situation here. So make sure all of your emphasis is on what he does right. Yeah, I tried to teach him all over again on this toilet-training but all he did was to sit on the floor. Anyway, like you, I believe these are two different issues. I believe my dog has a relapse in toilet-training (which I am training him all over again) but I also believe that he purposely pooed and peed whenever he can't see me (as this has been going on since he was 2 months old, before he was toilet-trained yet! Even when he was toilet-trained at 3 mths old, he will still pooed/peed at the place where he last saw me)

Do not allow the dog to watch you clean up the mess after the accident too. On the other hand, every time your dog finishes meals take him out for potty by create a 'timetable'. The more comfortable he is without you (with the toy training and potty schedule) the better his success will be. Can you elaborate more on the toy training? He doesn't seemed to be interested in his toys, unless he has nothing to do and if I do not play with him, only then he start playing with them. Also, how does potty schedule make him more comfortable without me? I am supposed to bring him go potty right?

Good luck.

Are you really a dog behaviorist? Maybe we could come and have a look at my dog. :p




Code


Code

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Lady Eloise
Dog Kichi


Mar 31, 2007, 9:53 AM

Post #7 of 11 (4302 views)
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Re: [cindy_pebbles] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post

Hmnnnn

Your dog has separation anxiety and it has becoming behavioral issues. Sad to tell you that cannot 'cure' the dog from having separation anxiety BUT you STILL can only control it. It seems your dog has passed his potty training but why he still pee and poop? The answer is your dog doesn't like to be alone and his respond to being alone by barking and moving around. Subsequently, he looses control of his bowel and bladder. That is why he cant hold his pee. It could be a part from (separation anxiety) boredom too, manipulation and a lack of exercise.

You have no choice except you MUST give him plenty of exercise. Remember, fish suppose to swim, bird suppose to fly and dog suppose to walk and sniff. Stating from now you have to go for a long walk around the neighborhood. This is good to reduce his anxiety and if you have time try this exercise everyday or before leaving the house. Try this 1st for (at least) 20 minutes or so. Let him out for a good romp in a field or a quiet street to stimulate his senses. I think he is 'too attached' with the smell inside your house and need something challenging. Thus he is frustrated and nervous. Walking him will be great and do wonders if you could 'reprogram' his senses and let out his 'negative energy' inside.

The following stages should be undertaken AFTER his exercise/walking time...or if you have some time to spend at home, such as on a weekend. You must follow through with consistency and discipline. Ask your mum or family members to participate too.

Stages

* Stage 1 - Introduce mental separation. Completely ignore the dog
for a period of 30 minutes while in the same room. Ignoring means: do
not touch, look at, or speak to the dog. Just let him drink and relax after the exercise.
* Stage 2 - Introduce physical separation. Restrict the dog's access to
you. Create a play area or small area as his sanctuary. This could be done with the use of baby gate and toys (like I suggest before) which the dog can chew through. Combine with mental separation.
* Stage 3 - Increase the distance of the physical separation. The dog being alone farther from you, but still within sight. Combine with mental separation.
* Stage 4 - Then slowly cut off dog's visual contact with you within the same room. He cannot see you, but he can smell you and hear you. If he starts to follow and come near you, ask him to go back and stay. Ask him to be quite then ignore him. Repeat this until he learns.
* Stage 5- Move dog into another room while you are still home. Dog
can still hear you and smell you. You might also place a recently worn
article of your clothing along the bottom of the door. Do turn the radio for him or TV. When you leave try turning something on that is there on a normal basis.

What To Do in the Meantime

* Restrict dog to a room or place where he can do minimal damage.
(Be sure there are no electrical cords within reach.)
* If your dog is not a toy oriented, classify the dog's toys into "A" and "B"groups. "A" toys are those that are irresistible, and the "B" toys are
those that he likes but are less exciting. When you leave him, give him
several "B" toys. These will help keep him occupied without over
stimulating him. Try a Kong- stuff with plain peanut butter as the irresistible ones.
* Feed him a small meal/water about 45 minutes to an hour before leaving.
* IGNORE your dog for the 30 minutes before you leave home, and do
not say good- bye.
* When you return, ignore your dog for the first ten minutes. If you
cannot bring yourself to totally ignore him, at least keep your greeting
very low key.

Remember this formula: EXERCISE + LEADERSHIP + DISCIPLINE + AFFECTION = Balanced dog.



Frown
Dog behaviorist.

(This post was edited by Lady Eloise on Mar 31, 2007, 10:17 AM)


cindy_pebbles
Member


Apr 2, 2007, 9:42 PM

Post #8 of 11 (4274 views)
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Re: [Lady Eloise] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post

Frown Hi!

Hmnnnn

Your dog has separation anxiety and it has becoming behavioral issues. Sad to tell you that cannot 'cure' the dog from having separation anxiety BUT you STILL can only control it. It seems your dog has passed his potty training but why he still pee and poop? The answer is your dog doesn't like to be alone and his respond to being alone by barking and moving around. Subsequently, he looses control of his bowel and bladder. That is why he cant hold his pee. It could be a part from (separation anxiety) boredom too, manipulation and a lack of exercise. Mostly he will bark but will stay put at the area where he could best see me. He also will look into mirrors (lotsa mirrors in my house) to see any reflection of me or anyone. By 30 secs, if no one response to his bark, he will then eliminate on the spot where he was standing. Sometimes I wonder if my dog has poor bladder control? Maybe health problem?

You have no choice except you MUST give him plenty of exercise. Remember, fish suppose to swim, bird suppose to fly and dog suppose to walk and sniff. Stating from now you have to go for a long walk around the neighborhood. This is good to reduce his anxiety and if you have time try this exercise everyday or before leaving the house. Try this 1st for (at least) 20 minutes or so. Let him out for a good romp in a field or a quiet street to stimulate his senses. I think he is 'too attached' with the smell inside your house and need something challenging. Thus he is frustrated and nervous. Walking him will be great and do wonders if you could 'reprogram' his senses and let out his 'negative energy' inside. Ok! Will do that asap! I have not brought him out for a walk for sometime now coz it has been raining these months! However, I do let him play in the garden many times a week.

The following stages should be undertaken AFTER his exercise/walking time...or if you have some time to spend at home, such as on a weekend. You must follow through with consistency and discipline. Ask your mum or family members to participate too.

Stages

* Stage 1 - Introduce mental separation. Completely ignore the dog
for a period of 30 minutes while in the same room. Ignoring means: do
not touch, look at, or speak to the dog. Just let him drink and relax after the exercise.
* Stage 2 - Introduce physical separation. Restrict the dog's access to
you. Create a play area or small area as his sanctuary. This could be done with the use of baby gate and toys (like I suggest before) which the dog can chew through. Combine with mental separation. (Can I put him in a crate? My crate was kinda big)
* Stage 3 - Increase the distance of the physical separation. The dog being alone farther from you, but still within sight. Combine with mental separation. Meaning ignoring him and put him in the crate?
* Stage 4 - Then slowly cut off dog's visual contact with you within the same room. He cannot see you, but he can smell you and hear you. If he starts to follow and come near you, ask him to go back and stay. Ask him to be quite then ignore him. Repeat this until he learns. Meaning ignoring him, put him in the crate and stay away so that he can't see me but can hear me right?
* Stage 5- Move dog into another room while you are still home. Dog
can still hear you and smell you. You might also place a recently worn
article of your clothing along the bottom of the door. Do turn the radio for him or TV. When you leave try turning something on that is there on a normal basis. Meaning put him into the room, close the door, put clothes at the bottom of the door (outside)? Must it be a huge room or a small room? What if he needs to poo/pee? Can i lock him in the toilet?

I am supposed to do this stages slowly or do it in a day, after the exercising?

What To Do in the Meantime

* Restrict dog to a room or place where he can do minimal damage.
(Be sure there are no electrical cords within reach.) my house is super small and I don't have a room for him, unless I put him in my room which has an attached bathroom and hopefully he will go in to do his business. Can I put him in my crate like that I did right now? The crate is kinda huge and can fit easily 6 mini schnauzers in.
* If your dog is not a toy oriented, classify the dog's toys into "A" and "B"groups. "A" toys are those that are irresistible, and the "B" toys are
those that he likes but are less exciting. When you leave him, give him
several "B" toys. These will help keep him occupied without over
stimulating him. Try a Kong- stuff with plain peanut butter as the irresistible ones. Bought him Kong but somehow he doesn't like it much. He seemed to lose his interest very quickly and unless I am there throwing the toys for him to fetch, he usually will not touch it. What about rawhide? He will sometimes chew them when he got nothing to do.
* Feed him a small meal/water about 45 minutes to an hour before leaving.
* IGNORE your dog for the 30 minutes before you leave home, and do
not say good- bye. that means i have to get up 30 minutes earlier? hehe. Usually after he go poo/pee, i feed him and straight leave the house. Ok, will do that.
* When you return, ignore your dog for the first ten minutes. If you
cannot bring yourself to totally ignore him, at least keep your greeting
very low key. Ok! He was very very very excited when I'm back from work. Will be there barking when he hears my car! Hehe..will kept barking excitedly until I let him out of his crate. Oh, btw, i put him in his crate during work as I don't trust him roaming freely yet. could it be a reason why he is like that?

Remember this formula: EXERCISE + LEADERSHIP + DISCIPLINE + AFFECTION = Balanced dog.

Thanks a lot for your advice and help!
I am thinking of getting a female dog at home since he is neutered but do you think this is make the situation worse? Or should I wait until I deal with him first before getting another dog?




Dog behaviorist.

We have a new member in our family! Her name is Jessie, a toy poodle!



Visit Benji's blog to find out more!



http://www.benjiboyboy.blogspot.com





zephyros
Canine Addict


Oct 24, 2007, 9:39 PM

Post #9 of 11 (3890 views)
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Re: [cindy_pebbles] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post

Mostly he will bark but will stay put at the area where he could best see me. He also will look into mirrors (lotsa mirrors in my house) to see any reflection of me or anyone. By 30 secs, if no one response to his bark, he will then eliminate on the spot where he was standing. Sometimes I wonder if my dog has poor bladder control? Maybe health problem?


from what I've read and the solutions given i'd say he covered almost everything. For this issue I'd say you let him learnt that. Maybe not by you, maybe your mom or someone thought him this. By weepooing, he will get attention. if all else fails, bear with the stench temporarily after he does his business. right now, you are responding to his business. He learnt that, as long as he does what he does, he'll get attention. as simple as that. your doggy is 3 months right? maybe his bladder isn't properly developed. no matter how well trained, accidents do happen. my new pup is 2 months now. he knows where to go to weepoo. but accidents do happen. you can do what I do, get his toilet schedule. yea seriously. usually for pups it's about one hour. if he's consistant, be consistant taking him to the toilet. see if this helps.

Ok! Will do that asap! I have not brought him out for a walk for sometime now coz it has been raining these months! However, I do let him play in the garden many times a week.

be patient with the pup. he needs to build confidence. if he's afraid, dont' force it on to him. let him explore his fears etc. your job is to be his pillar of strength, NOT the worrysome mother that will do everything for her child. might sound harsh, but hey, imagine this, be harsh now, and your pup grows up to be a confident dog that you can be proud of taking out with you, or a dog that whines and cries for every small reason that you don't even dare to show to relatives visiting your house. this is not that extreme. that's how dogs get abandoned. because owners can't stand the ill-behaviours of their dogs.

I am supposed to do this stages slowly or do it in a day, after the exercising?

i'm not too certain about his way, but from my understanding, you move on to the next stage AFTER he is 100% confortable with the current stage. if he fails the current stage, you need to re-try over and over till he gets it

Bought him Kong but somehow he doesn't like it much. He seemed to lose his interest very quickly and unless I am there throwing the toys for him to fetch, he usually will not touch it. What about rawhide? He will sometimes chew them when he got nothing to do.

try this. i made some chicken soup(you can use anything you like). put it into the kong toy or ice cube box. freeze it. give your pup one to lick/play/bite on. use something that he likes. dogs do better with food that smells good. attracts them faster that food that just taste good. that means i have to get up 30 minutes earlier? hehe. Usually after he go poo/pee, i feed him and straight leave the house. Ok, will do that.


that or you can wear your dog out. a tired/busy dog "usually" won't notice ur missing. worked with my pup.Ok! He was very very very excited when I'm back from work. Will be there barking when he hears my car! Hehe..will kept barking excitedly until I let him out of his crate. Oh, btw, i put him in his crate during work as I don't trust him roaming freely yet. could it be a reason why he is like that?

he has learnt that "you coming home" = freedom. so what was said, don't give attention as soon as u come back. alternative to that, if u really have a strong heart...wait till he quiets down. After the initial 10 mins, when u approach him, do not let him out yet. let him learn to say "please". for me, it's to sit down and wait quietly. my dogs don't get to eat if they jump on me. they don't get anything for that matter. now they've learnt that if they want something, they sit and wait. enforce this rule, no exception, and he'll learn.

I am thinking of getting a female dog at home since he is neutered but do you think this is make the situation worse? Or should I wait until I deal with him first before getting another dog?

don't. one dog is hard enough to train. two will make it worst as they will be totally ignoring you. also, they learn faster from each other, and usually the bad things if the older one is not trained yet to begin with. so do not get another dog now. wait till he grows up and learns the house rules.

on the side note. what are you using to clean your pup's accidents? do check that the detergent you use does not contain ammonia. this is the easiest thing most owners forget and could lead to more accidents with pups.


smokey774
Novice


Nov 18, 2007, 7:24 PM

Post #10 of 11 (3812 views)
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Re: [cindy_pebbles] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post

if you have seen the show "its me or the dog" there is an episode that teaches how to solve this. ill try to sum it up. when you leave time and time again she learns that you leaving means she did something wrong and now she is left alone. try this: when you have time, sit her in front of the door or even in her crate and go out the door. immediately come back in and sit down. do this repeditly over and over until she no longer has that worried look. you can also give her something tasty to chew when you do leave so she isnt bored. with each session increase the length you are outside. when you do come back in ignore her, praising her will only increase this anxiety and cause her to want you to come back everytime it will cause her to be upset. so just ignore her adn if she is out of the crate ignore her when you come back in asnd she should quickly be desensitised. this may take a while and you may have to touch up from time to time so her anxiety does relapse.



hope this helps!


zephyros
Canine Addict


Nov 29, 2007, 1:49 AM

Post #11 of 11 (3675 views)
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Re: [cindy_pebbles] Separation Anxiety! [In reply to] Can't Post

hi cindy

any updates on your MS?

 
 




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