Malaysia Dog and Puppy Portal: Behavioral Problems: Behavioural Issues - General: Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed!

Home


	MAIN INDEX	FAQ & HELP	PHOTO GALLERY	WHO'S ONLINE	LOG IN

Home: Behavioral Problems: Behavioural Issues - General:
Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed!

Enroll Your Furkids To Training Classes

Building a great bond and relationship with your dog

Find out more >>>

hunter
Ultra ALPHA

Apr 11, 2003, 11:47 PM

Post #1 of 19 (4133 views)
Shortcut

Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed!	Can't Post

hello fellow doggie lovers,

hi all. my GR is 2 years old now. and i'm starting to worry about my dog's extreme fear towards thunder and ligthning during the raining season. a thread was posted regarding this topic before in the gundog section, but i need more advice about this...

u see, when the sky is dark, thunder roars and lightning strikes, my dog's whole body - head to tail -will begin shivering, breathing really heavily. he is very upset about the loud noise out there, and is certainly very scared - his muscles are all tensed and his heart is beating really fast. he won't leave us for even an inch - lean on us wherever we go in the house, shivering like a vibrating handphone.

he is 2 years old already, i seriously think he has passed the puppy's age and should be able to cope with this in a better way. what should i do to correct him? should i :

A. stop pampering him, lock him outside (with
shaded roof), let him get used to it.
B. be at his side the whole time, give him company
and ensure him that there is nothing to be afraid
of (have been trying this for months - no result)
C. other suggestions?

May
Old Hand

Apr 12, 2003, 12:22 AM

Post #2 of 19 (4126 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi Hunter!!

My dog had the same problem just like Hunter when she was a puppy.

Method (B) won't work cos when u attempt to reassure him when he�s afraid u may reinforce his fearful behavior. He may interpret this as a reward for his fearful behavior. Instead, try to behave normally, as if you don�t notice his fearfulness.

Maybe you should try to create a safe place for him, a place that he consider safe and not you. To you maybe the kennel is a safe place for him but to him maybe it's not. In my case, my dog loves to hide under the sofa all the time cos she thinks that a safe place for her. So whenever she hear thunder roars and lightning strikes, she'll hide under the sofa too.

Now that she had passed her puppyhood, she still like to do that but she's not afraid of thunder and lighting like before. Sometimes when it rains so heavily, she'll prefer to lay down at the front door and enjoy the weather.

(This post was edited by May on Apr 12, 2003, 12:29 AM)

cshellz
Ultra ALPHA

Apr 12, 2003, 12:50 AM

Post #3 of 19 (4119 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi hunter!

I had the same problem with Richie when he was younger. At first we also tried to manja him...like hold and hug him till it subsides a little. But as he grew older we kinda trained him to get used to it by acting like it was nothing. We'd go on talking to him and playing with him. Once I even tried to fool him to thinking I was sleeping on the couch. He was whining next to me but I ignored him so after sometime he also just kept quiet and went to sleep beside me. And after that, he kinda got used to it. He jumps whenever the lightning and thunder comes too suddenly or when it's too loud. But then he can go back to sleep right after the sudden jolt. Smile

Hope ur doggie can overcome this soon!

milooh
Member

Apr 12, 2003, 6:24 PM

Post #4 of 19 (4108 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Act like nothing happened. If you manja him he would know you are making a big deal of the thunder and lightning. If you happen to be playing with him when there is thunder, give him a treat right away. He will associate this with treats and fun. Hope this helps.

milooh
Rossie
www.jef-b.com/Dogs

hunter
Ultra ALPHA

Apr 14, 2003, 7:36 AM

Post #5 of 19 (4093 views)
Shortcut

Re: [All] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

hi guys,

right. no more reassurance for this guy anymore. thanks for the input guys.

actually i've tried that way before.. i mean, ignoring him, pretend as if nothing happens. but minutes later his shivering makes me worry - and i can't help but to give him some reassurance... u know, like when a child tells u he's afraid of the boogie monster, you tell him there's no such thing as the boogie monster...

i guess i'll just stop giving signs of encouragement towards his fears. thanks for the input :D !

regards,
hunter

cshellz
Ultra ALPHA

Apr 14, 2003, 6:08 PM

Post #6 of 19 (4088 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

hi hunter,

good luck with your goldie!! Yeah, I understand, at the beginning when u see them shiver like that sure "heart pain"....but it's for their own good. At least when they are used to it, you don't have to worry about them each time there's thunder and lighting and u're not at home. Smile

Ausranger
Dog Kichi

Apr 17, 2003, 9:38 PM

Post #7 of 19 (4050 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hunter

I'll keep my fingers crossed for you. And if anyone has any more ideas let me know. Both my dogs never used to mind the thunder and lightning, but since coming to KL where you really know how to have storms, they've both developed a fear. Niles is the worst, he shivers and shakes big time.

I've never pampered or babied either one of them, I just try and ignore it, but it's not getting any better and it's certainly not a puppy thing as they're both middle aged (7 and 6). I think Emmy has picked up the anxiety from Niles.

Dorothy

jasonlyh
Enthusiast

Apr 18, 2003, 6:15 AM

Post #8 of 19 (4043 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi Hunter... my previous GSD had the same problem. He even howl and scrathes the door. Even to the extend of opening the gate and running off. Tried everything but does not work. If anyone has any good suggestion, it would be most welcoming. I guess it's kinda hard since the dog does not know where the loud thunder is coming from or whats happening.

Tracey
New User

Dec 31, 2003, 12:16 PM

Post #9 of 19 (3880 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

If anyone can help, I have a GSD 4 1/2yrs that we adopted. He will bark and whine NON STOP until the storm is over. I have tried putting him outside, giving him his own secure place, sympathy and disciplining him. None of it works, if the storm lasts 7 hours (which they have) then he will bark and whine NON STOP for 7 hours!!!!!

Help as he is driving us mad!!! Unsure

hunter
Ultra ALPHA

Dec 31, 2003, 5:15 PM

Post #10 of 19 (3875 views)
Shortcut

Re: [Tracey] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

hello tracey

what i've learnt was, if your dog is particularly worried with the presence of thunder and lightning, the most important thing is that we ourselves should not fear the thunder and lightning, and must always appear relaxed to the dog.

also, we shouldn't be touching, hugging the dog to give reassurance as he'll only understand it as a praise for his behavior and hence will associate fear with praise. just briefly tell him it's okay and there's nothing to worry about :) b'sides, 4 1/2 yrs dog is not a puppy no more, so i guess this'll have to take time :/

regards,
hunter

a_evie
Doggyman

Dec 31, 2003, 6:26 PM

Post #11 of 19 (3873 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

crackers had that problem since since she came over to stay with us. also the same problems with fire crackers as well.

initially we gave in to her like allowing her to enter the house and rooms (she scratched the doors bad time)....but a friend taught me to ignore her (very difficult) and provide her some space to hide from troubled times. so we created this shelter of leafy plants at the corner of our porch fro her to hide. that worked!

just have to be patient. basically i ignored her and would carry her to her spot. sit with her for a while. then walk away and insist that she obeys "stay". then i disappear either upstairs or just sit in the living room and ignore all the commotion from her.

try it!
Wink

surchinmy
Ultra ALPHA

Dec 31, 2003, 6:49 PM

Post #12 of 19 (3872 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi ya ...

Yeaps ... agree with everyone ...

As a general rule, pampering or catering to a dog's "unreasonable anxiety or fear" ... or exposing the dog in isolation to the "element" causing the anxiety (in hope that the dog will learn by itself, not to be frightened) ... are not answers ... Neither are likely to eradicate nor improve the situation.

Coddling rewards the dog for being frightened, encourages the doggie to think that exhibiting anxiety or fear is appropriate behaviour - thus, imbedding the "bad" habit ...

Exposing the dog in isolation to the fear causing "element" merely causes the dog to withdraw even more ...

Proper "desensitisation to fear elements" requires the owner's participation ... and the dog is exposed to the "element causing fear" in a controlled and monitored way - teaching the lesson that the "element" is nothing to be afraid of ...

Our male RR hates thunder (he makes a beeline for the daybed, sticks his head between the cushions ... cute but not very desirable ... Crazy

) ...

(a) Do not coddle the dog, but do not scold or reprimand the dog either ... as far as you are concerned it is a non event.

(b) Act normally, and show the dog that "you" are not frightened ...

If you have another dog/s - play with them ... thunder is the recess bell for fun & games for everyone.
Engage the dog in his favourite game or pastime ... play fetch, retrieve, go into your training routine ... whatever.
Everytime thunder sounds or lightening strikes - call the dog to you & perform a command (encourage the dog away from his hiding place) and reward with a special treat ... (Remember, this treat must be associated the act of obeying a command and not for being frightened).

Hopefully with consistency ... the dog learns to associate the loud noise in the sky with good & happy events ... and even if the anxiety does not go away completely, it is diminished.

Cheers Smile

(This post was edited by surchinmy on Dec 31, 2003, 6:53 PM)

aragorn2976
Ultra ALPHA

Dec 31, 2003, 10:12 PM

Post #13 of 19 (3864 views)
Shortcut

Re: [surchinmy] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Totally agree with you on this... Wink

I remembered watching a show called Barking Mad on Astro which demonstrated this dog who had a problem with loud noises. When it heard it, the dog would run under a table and its legs would shake. Tongue

The vet on the show advised that you must treat this as a normal event and show no reaction to it. One should not coddle or pat the dog to comfort it as well. One should also not scold the dog too.

They even tested the dog to see if it would react the same way if a tape with loud noises were played on the stereo. Unimpressed

In the end, as you said surchinmy, associating the noise with happy events did solve the problem.

Join the JRT Zone

Beloved, let us love one another, because love is of God; everyone who loves is begotten by God and knows God. - 1 John 4:7 (Oofy's motto)

hunter
Ultra ALPHA

Dec 31, 2003, 11:08 PM

Post #14 of 19 (3862 views)
Shortcut

Re: [a_evie] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

hi

my dog used to have fear of fire crackers as well :)

but speaking of that, he had cured his firecrackers/fireworks phobia quite sometime ago. initially my dad tied him outside when there's firecrackers and fireworks for like... 15 minutes.

now when there's fire crackers and fireworks he'll be the first one to run out and bark bark bark :/

as for thunder, i seriously would not want to allow him to hide somewhere... as i worry he might have to face thunder alone when we're not in. he might not have a place to hide then (coz we lock him at the backyard, it's sheltered for him)

he's doing good now i suppose. thanks for the advice btw :)

hunter
Ultra ALPHA

Dec 31, 2003, 11:20 PM

Post #15 of 19 (3861 views)
Shortcut

Re: [surchinmy] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

hi sk

as this was an old post, hunter did have problems with thunder and lightning last time.

and then he somehow managed to cure the thunder/lightning phobia, i don't know how. maybe by the sit stays i asked him to do under the sheltered backyard (i'm there with him as well)

recently, this habit is back again :/ my fault also, coz the last rainy season was terrible and i am scared of thunder myself. he sees me worry and then he got worried as well.

now he's not only scared of thunder and lightning, has also learnt to fear strong wind during rain and the rain itself. his fear is bad, coz he'll shiver terribly, breathe rapidly, and stick so close to us that he's always in our way when we're busy with our stuffs. he wouldn't find a place to hide. he'll just stick close to us. he's certainly not interested in games or treats at all, so normally i'd just do some obedience stuffs with him to let him relaxed.

now i think things are getting better.. but still a far way to go. yesterday i made him ate his apples outside. i really thought the phobia was gone for good last time. but it seems it'll just come back and come back. could it be due to age also?

thanks for the great advices. think i'll try them.

hey btw i think male RR stucking his head into cushions is definitely the cutest ! maybe u should consider leave this habit as it is :p ~~~

Tracey
New User

Jan 1, 2004, 8:21 AM

Post #16 of 19 (3852 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi;

Thanks for all the replies, We do go about our business and ignore it as we are not bothered by storms. We play with the other dogs (3) and everyone is happy and he will have nothing to do with anything except to cry and whine the whole time and he will get very aggressive with the other dogs if they are not standing at alert while he is having his little fit Smile

. We tried all the methods you have mention when we first got him then I heard to just ignore it go about your business. We have also tried playing sounds of thunder really low and keeping him distracted. He goes bezerk at the slightest rumble. We have been doing this for months now and he seems to be getting worse not better. He paces and barks and whines at loud noises (gun shot, thunder, blasting, plane going over head). He has his own safe place and will not go near it when there is a storm. He will have nothing to do with treats or anything he just keeps carrying on. I guess we will just have to learn to live with it and pray there is no storms at night when we are trying to sleep Smile

surchinmy
Ultra ALPHA

Jan 1, 2004, 10:01 AM

Post #17 of 19 (3850 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi ... yeah, it was like *oops* ... only realised how old your post was after I made reply ... Crazy

...

Quote

but it seems it'll just come back and come back. could it be due to age also?

I don't think it has anything to do with age per se ... It requires much time & patience to help a dog get over a "fear" ...

The best we can do is reduce the anxiety or fear little by little, and try to desensitise the dog to the "fear" element; and sometimes, when we are not consistent enough - dogs can regress & the fear comes back.

The good thing is, because you & the dog worked at overcoming the fear before, it's easier sorting out the problem the 2nd time round.

And as you say, because Hunter is so close to you, he can pick up your anxiety too ...

Cheers Smile

...

surchinmy
Ultra ALPHA

Jan 1, 2004, 10:27 AM

Post #18 of 19 (3848 views)
Shortcut

Re: [Tracey] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

Hi ...

At 4 1/2 years ... it is very possible that your dog's fear of storms is already quite well-ingrained ... and that makes it harder to sort out ... And from your other post in the "dominant dog" thread ... it sounds like you have a dog with a generally nervous temperament ...

For sure, neither reprimands nor sympathy will help the situation ... both are likely to just make the dog more aware of his "fear" ...

The idea is to slowly but consistently desensitise the dog to storms ... Which is not easy - it's not like we can dial up a storm, whenever we wish to train our dog ... So, your training schedule will have to follow the weather ...

You can try the various methods that have already been posted ... And maybe you can try this:

(a) Don't wait for the storm to arrive before working with the dog ... because by that time, your dog may already be too nervous to pay you much attention.

Try working, playing, distracting the dog, as soon as you suspect a storm or rain is approaching and before the storm actually arrives ... catch the dog early - before the its anxiety level grows too great ...

(b) Also work at building a strong bond with your dog (though regular play & training sessions) ... the more the dog learns to trust you ... the more secure the dog becomes ... and that's great foundation; and will make it that much easier to distract the dog when the storm arrives.

Cheers

(This post was edited by surchinmy on Jan 1, 2004, 10:30 AM)

a_evie
Doggyman

Jan 2, 2004, 5:31 PM

Post #19 of 19 (3840 views)
Shortcut

Re: [hunter] Fear of thunder + lightning a little extreme. advice needed! [In reply to]	Can't Post

great to hear that your dog is fine...

btw, hide means sit in the comfy and safe zone that we set up for her.