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shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ?????





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hunter
Ultra ALPHA


Mar 3, 2003, 5:49 AM

Post #1 of 40 (2991 views)
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shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? Can't Post
dear all,

hello. today mka presented us a really eye-opening demo at padang merbuk... i'm not sure what kind of training is it called as i am having a hard time listening to the handler's introduction from a far distance... what is it called? a schoo-hoon training?

anyway, it really amazed me how focused are those dogs are.. not to mention the XXXXL dumbell being used with no problem at all.

they did mention that there're competitions for such trainings. are they categorised under obedience competitions? just hoping to know more about this sort of training as it is rarely seen/mentioned in malaysia.

guess that's about all. just some feedbacks about this demo. thanks.


regards,
hunter.


arthur
ALPHA


Mar 3, 2003, 9:01 AM

Post #2 of 40 (2983 views)
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Re: [hunter] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi Hunter,

That was a great demo huh? Smile What was shown today is called the sport of Schutzhund. It was developed originally in Germany to test the working ability of the GSD. It is also used to test the dog for potential breeding stock.

Schutzhund (dog sport in German) combines 3 main disciplines..ie. tracking, obedience and protection. From this, you can see it is a very demanding sport which also brings immense satisfication to get a true working dog that excels in it. Typical breeds participating in this sport are the GSD, Dobermans, Belgian Malinois, Rottweilers, Giant Schnauzers to name a few. Almost all are large breeds for the protection factor.

Schutzhund like obedience comes in three levels of increasing difficulty. These are Schutzhund 1,2 and 3. You must pass the lower levels before progressing on to the next level. I read that in Germany, to register a GSD for breeding, the dog must pass at least Schutzhund 1 level.

For a quick overview, check out this site - http://www.dvgamerica.com/whatis.html

For more details, check this site - http://www.k9web.com/...ties/schutzhund.html

Hope this info helps.

Rdgs Arthur


ginl
ALPHA


Mar 3, 2003, 10:03 AM

Post #3 of 40 (2980 views)
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Re: [arthur] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
That was Schutzhund demo?? And here i thought it was the open level obedience demo Blush....i thought Schutzhund was when the dog chases after the person pretending to be an intruder with the protective thingy on his arm and the dog will attack the arm? Or did i miss that part BlushCrazy....but i must say when the dog did the obedience work it was extremely impressive! The dog never took his eyes off the trainer....during heeling the dog's head was always tilting upwards and looking at the trainer waiting for the next command! Cool


hunter
Ultra ALPHA


Mar 6, 2003, 5:10 AM

Post #4 of 40 (2959 views)
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Re: [arthur] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
dear arthur,

whoa. schutzhund. a new term i learnt. thanks. it certainly is far more challenging than basic obedience like what we're learning right now.

i haven't heard anyone competing schutzhund in Malaysia. maybe protection training should be encouraged more here. as the article mentioned, some people simply don't bother to take control of their dog's aggresive behaviour, but instead get delighted at their dog's macho behaviour.

i just find that irresponsible. and sometimes their dogs end up ruining reputation of other dogs. making people "assume" that all dogs are mean and aggresive beings.


regards,
hunter


Polluxx
Enthusiast


Mar 11, 2003, 5:56 AM

Post #5 of 40 (2941 views)
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Re: [ginl] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi all,

Just wondering...will MKA be starting a Schutzhund club in the country in the near future..?? Any MKA members on board who know about this..?? I m sure a lot of GSD, Rotties..and other working breeds lover who will be very interested in it.






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 18, 2003, 7:43 PM

Post #6 of 40 (2826 views)
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Re: [arthur] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
Hi Hunter,

That was a great demo huh? Smile What was shown today is called the sport of Schutzhund. It was developed originally in Germany to test the working ability of the GSD. It is also used to test the dog for potential breeding stock.

Schutzhund (dog sport in German) combines 3 main disciplines..ie. tracking, obedience and protection. From this, you can see it is a very demanding sport which also brings immense satisfication to get a true working dog that excels in it. Typical breeds participating in this sport are the GSD, Dobermans, Belgian Malinois, Rottweilers, Giant Schnauzers to name a few. Almost all are large breeds for the protection factor.

Schutzhund like obedience comes in three levels of increasing difficulty. These are Schutzhund 1,2 and 3. You must pass the lower levels before progressing on to the next level. I read that in Germany, to register a GSD for breeding, the dog must pass at least Schutzhund 1 level.

For a quick overview, check out this site - http://www.dvgamerica.com/whatis.html

For more details, check this site - http://www.k9web.com/...ties/schutzhund.html

Hope this info helps.

Rdgs Arthur
Arthur,
you are basicly right about the discipline of SchH just would like to correct a bit of mistake when you mention almost all are large breed dogs. In fact not most but all large breed dogs and it has to be protective breed. The candidate for this work needs to have the right genetic make up and strong nerve and good drive to succeed. GSD, Malinios and Rottweiler are the more popular breed and yes Giant Schnauser too.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 18, 2003, 7:47 PM

Post #7 of 40 (2825 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
Hi all,

Just wondering...will MKA be starting a Schutzhund club in the country in the near future..?? Any MKA members on board who know about this..?? I m sure a lot of GSD, Rotties..and other working breeds lover who will be very interested in it.
This is a good hope. The more important thing is not to wait for MKA but if more people can understand more about working bloodlines and acquire such dogs into Malaysia and form enough members for training group to lobby MKA is a more positive way of approaching it.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


boon
Doggyman


Sep 18, 2003, 8:02 PM

Post #8 of 40 (2823 views)
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Re: [PSD] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi PSD,

any recommendation of reliable and relatively above average lineage (working) GSD to share ?

Boon - I Love Fast Dogs That Hit Hard
You Ask Me To Fight For You, I Give You Freedom & Protection And Then You Question The Manner In Which I Provide It, I'd Rather You Just Said -- "Thank You" --


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 18, 2003, 9:01 PM

Post #9 of 40 (2815 views)
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Re: [boon] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
Hi PSD,

any recommendation of reliable and relatively above average lineage (working) GSD to share ?
Boon,

There in fact some good working GSD's begining to make its way into Malaysia. However they are still like little pebbles flooded by the show dogs. I'm not a dog salesman but I do have an interest to see SchutzHund in Malaysia one day.

BTW, may I ask what you are going to do with a working line GSD?

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


boon
Doggyman


Sep 18, 2003, 9:06 PM

Post #10 of 40 (2813 views)
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Re: [PSD] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi PSD,

SchutzHund.Wink

Boon - I Love Fast Dogs That Hit Hard
You Ask Me To Fight For You, I Give You Freedom & Protection And Then You Question The Manner In Which I Provide It, I'd Rather You Just Said -- "Thank You" --


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 18, 2003, 10:00 PM

Post #11 of 40 (2807 views)
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Re: [boon] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Boon,

If we could meet up and discuss more about Schutzhund and working dogs, perhaps I can then recomend you some dogs. Meantime, find our from the net more about this sport as it requires a lot of commitment on your end. Please don't feel that I'm discouraging you as I do like your answers. Just want to be sure the dog is suitable for you first otherwise it will be unfair to you as well as the dog.

You can post questions about it if you need to seek any clarification. If I'm online I will do my best to help.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


boon
Doggyman


Sep 18, 2003, 10:27 PM

Post #12 of 40 (2804 views)
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Re: [PSD] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi PSD,

The third part of the game is the most interesting one, protection work and the requirement is very strict and not sure if we have it in Malaysia do our need to be CD before can go for level 1 training and competition.

Boon - I Love Fast Dogs That Hit Hard
You Ask Me To Fight For You, I Give You Freedom & Protection And Then You Question The Manner In Which I Provide It, I'd Rather You Just Said -- "Thank You" --


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 18, 2003, 11:14 PM

Post #13 of 40 (2798 views)
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Re: [boon] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
Hi PSD,

The third part of the game is the most interesting one, protection work and the requirement is very strict and not sure if we have it in Malaysia do our need to be CD before can go for level 1 training and competition.
You do not need CD. Can straight to SchH 1 the only requirement is that the dog is mature enough for the work and minimum age is 18 months old to be eligible for trials. You are right that the requirement is very strict as can see from here your dog have to be started from puppy inprinting right up to SchH1 trial which is roughly minimum 15 months of training before the trial. Some dog will take 2.5 years before they are ready for SchH1. This is why only top level graduates of puppy testing and long observation of the litter before a puppy be chosen for SchH training program.

Meantime, the dog can always be trained to trial in O/B to get the CD after 6 months. But special care must be taken to be very motivational and not based on high compulsion training as I see most people do with choker. The aim in this training is to teach the dog descretion and think on his own and react based on certain stimulus rather than being yanked here and there. In other words SchH dogs are highly disciplined, clear descretion, protective only when faced with threats from a 3rd person and a safe dog when handler is there.

Yes there are some SchH3 dogs currently in Malaysia if I'm not mistaken there are 4 of them but i would prefer them to be more in numbers.

Protection discipline is interesting indeed but the tracking and O/B is very important also otherwise the dog cannot pass the trial if they are not good in all 3 phase.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


boon
Doggyman


Sep 18, 2003, 11:45 PM

Post #14 of 40 (2794 views)
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Re: [PSD] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi PSD,

Thanz for your reply. Great to hear that there are 4 SchH3 dogs in Malaysia, are all of in KL or ?

Thank You

Boon - I Love Fast Dogs That Hit Hard
You Ask Me To Fight For You, I Give You Freedom & Protection And Then You Question The Manner In Which I Provide It, I'd Rather You Just Said -- "Thank You" --


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 19, 2003, 12:54 AM

Post #15 of 40 (2787 views)
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Re: [boon] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Unfortunately none of the dogs I know is in KL. To clarify I only know of GSD's and not any other breed. The rest are in Taiping, Kedah and Penang.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


boon
Doggyman


Sep 19, 2003, 1:00 AM

Post #16 of 40 (2784 views)
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Re: [PSD] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi PSD,

Oh...ok, i myself am from Penang, do u mind share with me who own the SchH3 GSD in Penang ?

Boon - I Love Fast Dogs That Hit Hard
You Ask Me To Fight For You, I Give You Freedom & Protection And Then You Question The Manner In Which I Provide It, I'd Rather You Just Said -- "Thank You" --


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 19, 2003, 1:43 AM

Post #17 of 40 (2775 views)
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Re: [boon] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
Hi PSD,

Oh...ok, i myself am from Penang, do u mind share with me who own the SchH3 GSD in Penang ?
For the person's own privacy, I'll be in trouble if I gives names on this board. They may not like it. Please understand. However if I know of any sessions here I'll PM you if you like. Only trouble is the people is far and few so not much sessions around but don't give up and seek more info on this if SchH appeals to you. Great to know you.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


Polluxx
Enthusiast


Sep 19, 2003, 5:37 AM

Post #18 of 40 (2766 views)
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Re: [PSD] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi PSD ,

Boy, am I surprise to see that this thread is being kept alive . . !

BTW guys dun forget abt Sch fan from the down under....hmmm I meant Johor...! ! Blush

Hopefully more ppl can join & start a Sch club or something...that will be a good 1st step..! Tongue

So PSD , now I know U r M'sian...which part of M'sia r u from...? ? I was just wondering maybe if we can start the club, we can get ppl like B. Flinks or H.Raiser to give seminar & training here for a start....Smile






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 19, 2003, 5:29 PM

Post #19 of 40 (2761 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
Hi PSD ,

BTW guys dun forget abt Sch fan from the down under....hmmm I meant Johor...! ! Blush

Hopefully more ppl can join & start a Sch club or something...that will be a good 1st step..! Tongue

So PSD , now I know U r M'sian...which part of M'sia r u from...? ? I was just wondering maybe if we can start the club, we can get ppl like B. Flinks or H.Raiser to give seminar & training here for a start....Smile
Flinks yup! He surely will be an excellent contributor for SchH in Malaysia. But before we get him over we have to get suitable dogs first and start basic inprinting. Otherwise he will be a real dissapoinment himself seing our softies show GSD's......malu lah.

I understand someone in Johor is trying to breed workinglines GSD. Was looking was broodstock but I'm not sure how this goes as yet.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


boon
Doggyman


Sep 19, 2003, 5:39 PM

Post #20 of 40 (2759 views)
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Re: [PSD] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi PSD,

May i know what is your name or u prefer me/us to refer u as PSD aka Corp Wong?Tongue It will be great to share a little about yourself with us, so we know each other better.

you can 'PM' me @ since the PM feature of this board was disabled.

Boon - I Love Fast Dogs That Hit Hard
You Ask Me To Fight For You, I Give You Freedom & Protection And Then You Question The Manner In Which I Provide It, I'd Rather You Just Said -- "Thank You" --


RealityDreamer
Doggyman


Sep 19, 2003, 8:41 PM

Post #21 of 40 (2748 views)
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Re: [PSD] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Smilehello

I agree with you strongly abt the soft show dogs..no point breeding dogs to only look good and can't perform their original tasks properly.

Anyway, can u notify me too if you know any Schutzhund trials going on?

my e-mail address is reality_dreamer69@hotmail.com

btw, do you know if there are any tracking or endurance trials held here?

I'm a fan of big dogs(esp working dogs) and I'm interested to know more Smile

At the moment, I hv a dobermann, bullmastiff and a cocker mix terrier.

Good to hv u on boardSmile
,-._,-.
\/)"(\/
(_o_)



Polluxx
Enthusiast


Sep 19, 2003, 9:06 PM

Post #22 of 40 (2742 views)
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Re: [PSD] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi PSD,

Quote :

"understand someone in Johor is trying to breed workinglines GSD. Was looking was broodstock but I'm not sure how this goes as yet. "

can u pass me his contact, I would be most interested, here's my e-mail address :

Quote :

"seing our softies show GSD's......malu lah. " Wink

I've seen SCH3 GSD (Show) which failed the protection works (in video), it seems some of these Sch title dogs can only performed at their own training ground so when they r tested in a new place / training grd their weak nerves took over. Unsure

I've been reading tht it seems in the recently concluded 2003 SV Sieger show, the courage test & protection works was more more harsh than before.

Is SV realising now the folly of its yesteryears . . . . . there may be hopes yet for our beloved breed... Smile

BTW PSD ...u haven't disclose which part of M'sia u r from...would be most interested.....! do e-mail me.






"Show me your dog and I'll tell you what manner of man you are."
(GSD Founder - Capt Max V Stephanitz)


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 19, 2003, 9:30 PM

Post #23 of 40 (2738 views)
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Re: [Polluxx] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
Hi PSD,
can u pass me his contact, I would be most interested, here's my e-mail address :


Polluxx, I don't know them. I only know from some rumour source that these people went all over the country looking for working dogs as broodstock. I was hoping it was you Laugh


In Reply To
I've seen SCH3 GSD (Show) which failed the protection works (in video), it seems some of these Sch title dogs can only performed at their own training ground so when they r tested in a new place / training grd their weak nerves took over. Unsure

What do you expect to happen?Cool Remember that SchH3 show dogs got their titles from chereographed training. Meaning same helper, same playground and even same spectatorsTongue These dogs are trained in 100%prey. therefore once in a different setting and especially when the unknown helper put on some threats stress onto
the dog they break like willows.

In Reply To
I've been reading tht it seems in the recently concluded 2003 SV Sieger show, the courage test & protection works was more more harsh than before.

Is SV realising now the folly of its yesteryears . . . . . there may be hopes yet for our beloved breed... Smile
I think its too late already. If they still cling onto to the current conformation broodstock its like meddling in a muddy water. Breeding is already hard enough with a clean stock. I'd rather stay with purebreads here.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 19, 2003, 9:34 PM

Post #24 of 40 (2737 views)
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Re: [RealityDreamer] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
Reality Dreamer,

I think may be too early to talk about trials now. We hardly have enough dogs of that genetic standards in Malaysia to even bring out but if more people supported and willing to invest in owning and training these dogs then I believe SchH will come to Malaysia.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)


PSD
ALPHA


Sep 19, 2003, 9:39 PM

Post #25 of 40 (2736 views)
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Re: [boon Poluxx] shooooo-hooon??? (schH3) ????? [In reply to] Can't Post
I beg you let me remain as PSD for now. Don't quite like popularity much. Prefer to be the caped avenger I think the girls like that betterTongue

Just send me a post here if you need me.

PSD

Quote
"Take this trouble for me:
Make sure my shepherd dog remains a working dog, for I have struggled all my life long for that aim ."

Rittmeister Capt. Max von Stephanitz (1864-1936)

(This post was edited by PSD on Sep 19, 2003, 9:55 PM)

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